[dr-moshe-admin]

hi there Konstantin,

My first thought in response to this is that, yes, you can ask them that question, but instead of asking a question that assumes there is something to learn for sure, like this:

“what lesson can you learn from this?”

You might ask it like this:

“Do you think there might be something to learn from this?”

You’d be surprised at how insightful many people actually are.

• This reply was modified 3 years, 6 months ago by  dr-moshe-admin. Reason: spelled there wrong

[dr-moshe-admin]

Mugdha,

You will definitely see trends in cases as they are a reflection of the time and / or of your own self.

How many cases have you had?

[dr-moshe-admin]

hi Erin and Mugdha,

yes. that is what I call a “Preemptive strike.”

People beat themselves up or can be hard on themselves to soften the blow when others do it to them. It’s a form of defense that has become habitual and we understand where it comes from, but now, at this point, it’s actually causing them the very harm they had been attempting to soften the blow of.

I think this patient’s words, from Mugdha, is very apropos. very good idea.
“Thank you fear for keeping me alive….we have been in partnership….but I am at a point now that I don’t need to have you around, you don’t let me ease, you feel like work….I don’t need you anymore….Letting you go will make my day softer…more flexible…I will not feel as rushed, I will have time for both for my creativity and being a mom….I can be in the moment”

So yes, i understand where it came from and why i did it, and why i’ve wanted to do it, but i can see it’s no longer serving me.

Good questions – what does it serve you? “oh nothing.” important to then ask what it may be serving negatively. this is very often quite a helpful question at such junctures.

the idea would be to get them to see it’s not helping them.

And Erin ultimately, these people are avoiding or compensating for the pain. So it will help them a lot by going into the very thing they are doing to themselves to avoid.

what is the worst thing for you about being blindsided? Or something bad happening? etc.

[dr-moshe-admin]

Thoughts create your reality is one way to say it which is more of a commitment to you as a practitioner who isn’t certain or wanting to go there so much, as well as for your patient. Rather, the idea that when we believe something, we tend to pick up on it more. It’s like when you never thought of something or even knew it existed, then you learn about it and start seeing it everywhere. We can begin seeing something everywhere that we hold strongly in our mind, which serves to reinforce it.

In such a case, I’d like to go into the traumatic past and see what the underlying lesson was/is for her. For eg, with some traumas, the lesson is, I never felt I could stand up for myself. Or, I never felt anyone would believe me if I told them about the abuse. That kind of thing. What is it for her? You could always explain the angle that if she “graduates” the lesson, then she is free to let the traumatic past go. She’s probably still holding on to what the underlying life lesson is for her in it. Better boundaries? Shouting no!?!?! Not believing she deserves it?

Something therein, I’d wager.

Does that give you something to work with?

🧐

[dr-moshe-admin]

They don’t like to talk about things. They’re grumpy. They feel forced. They don’t know how they really feel. All of that.

Some light talking, connecting with them about their interests for a while, and also taking the time to explain to them what you’re doing and how it can benefit them for their entire lives is also a good idea.

[dr-moshe-admin]

That’s so tricky. My guess is that she is very disconnected to her feelings and that her conscious mind is very strong and in control. I have rarely resolved a case where it is stuck at present in around that much time, but with it comes a lot of movement of energy, emotion, and an active improvement of symptoms. It sounds like she is comfortably sitting within her mental /intellect control mind and is controlling the direction of the case. That is tough. There has to be a yielding to the practitioner in order to go deep and to the point. IT’s not a total loss though as it sounds like she had some insights, but you have more work to do there. Remember “When there’s an element that is directly blocking the process, the practitioner must address it”? You’re probably there.

🤗

[dr-moshe-admin]

I’ve had cases like this. I keep exploring the belief – what is it attached to?

Ask how much she feels it is not true and what %age she still feels is true. Then ask her what is inside the %age that is still true? Try to find the attachments, the so-called tendrils. Keep working on it.

What would life look like without this belief?

What makes her feel this way? What are the things that bring it up? (you can then explore through this situations… it may yield an opening to the real attachments)

Consider a homeopathic remedy to assist.

🤓

[dr-moshe-admin]

hi Mugdha,

sounds like you got her right to the point. At such a place, I would emphasize that it seems very likely that if she does not shift this, she will continue to suffer. I’d also remind her (if you hadn’t already) that we have everything we “need” inside of us, ie we don’t need anything. To believe we need something keeps us needing that thing which therefore becomes the belief around which suffering takes form.

did you ask her where the idea came from that she needs a partner to be happy?

Where you got with her saying:

“I love myself and I do not need anyone else to love me” (after saying that to the little girl within her), she said I cannot say that, my love bucket it empty, I cannot give what I don’t have.

things you can try –

you could challenge her with some questions around, “What makes you think your bucket of love is empty?” It makes me scratch my head. her bucket is empty? Love is kept in a bucket and when it empties out, there’s no more love to give? Ask her about what she means by this? And is this love for another the same bucket as for the self? just questioning these things may shift things a little.

You could say, “OK. So then keep it up.” (this is an edgy question and is a bit of a gamble. like calling someone’s bluff. it sometimes works.

or

“What makes you think your love bucket is empty?” where is the evidence of that/ what would it take to make it full so you can then love yourself again?

let’s say she says, “well, the love bucket only gets full by being in a love relationship.” Ask her, is that true? What makes you think that’s true?

these are some ideas to try.

And… Don’t let her being convinced there’s nothing she can do convince you there’s nothing she can do.

[dr-moshe-admin]

The basic idea is “what are they still struggling with?” If they are feeling great in regards to their original complaint, you can keep it easy and not delve anywhere with them. Or if they are still suffering with their original complaint, what is making them suffer? What is the essence of their problem spot? The dialogue, you can tell them, will pick up where you left off and dive deeper. If the original complaint is fine but there is something else bothering them, so you can tell them you’ll be having another dialogue based on that.

As for how much follow up details, always get a sense of how their chief issues are doing now that you discovered during the previous visit.

[dr-moshe-admin]

Another great resource is Dr. Erin Moore, who is a ND and our first Holistic Counseling Certified practitioner, she is offering a workshop for ladies only here: https://drerinmoore.mykajabi.com/heal-you-inner-child

Here’s some writing she did on this last year.

https://www.drerinmoore.com/mind-body-meld/inner-child-work

here is the link to Dr. Erin Moore’s inner child healing workshop –

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1pQDVRO9Ex4XFUAkrrT-V4vFKZL1jh1-u/view?usp=sharing

• This reply was modified 5 years ago by  dr-moshe-admin.

[dr-moshe-admin]

his physical symptoms didn’t improve much. ALS is suspected. I had around 6 appointments with him with little improvement of his physicals. Emotional improvement also plateau’d. I haven’t seen him in many months. We remain in touch and may continue. He decided to try other therapies, like CBD, low dose naltrexone, etc. He wanted a concrete diagnosis and it was hard to come by.

thanks for asking. If it is ALS, I have found it to be a very difficult condition to help physically, that may account for the lack of significant improvement. also, the mental-emotional symptoms / beliefs also were very hard to shift.

I think there is a bit of a “limitation of holistic counseling” with guru as the number one issue. It can be a problem if only the guru has the answers. That’s my hunch for the stuckness in the case. Externalizing the answers to the guru.

🧐

[dr-moshe-admin]

That is so great to hear Dr. Erin, and it’s a great sign, like a milestone, for you as a healer, to be detached enough from your mom to help her with HC.

Hooray! Well done! 😇

[dr-moshe-admin]

hi Shonna,

you bet. My pleasure.

just a nerdy technical aspect of the forums here, you can click off the reply screen and go back to the previous text and then copy whatever you want, and then click on “reply” again to bring back your started reply.

[dr-moshe-admin]

hi Lisa,

Module 1 Lesson 2 Quiz was set to 90% passing grades. Kind of high. So I put it to 80%. That was probably the issue. 😅

<<One other question- We are required to turn in 2 write ups for self evaluation of 2 cases. Are these the same as the quiz which is really a self evaluation? Or re we to do a different physical write up also?>>

Those two quizzes are the write-ups.

this is #1 – https://course.holistic-counseling.ca/topic/vis-dialogue-self-assessment-write-up-2/

and this is #2 – https://course.holistic-counseling.ca/topic/vis-dialogue-self-assessment-write-up-2-2/

Vis Dialogue Self-Assessment Write-up #1

[dr-moshe-admin]

So Alex and Maeshowe, the answer to your questions Alex are reflected in the kinds of questions Maeshowe is proposing. That is exactly the kind of thing we need to begin doing when the dialogue begins to get deeper and begins that “circling the drain” kind of thing.

I have just recently discovered a better way of teaching this aspect of the Vis Dialogue. The way I am beginning to teach it is by a more elaborate description of question types.

Type A questions – Completely non directional and non descript. Egs “How does that feel?” “What is that like for you?” Tell me more.

Type B questions – These are more like opening up a fence to coral the horses into the fence. Meaning, the question has specifics you’re looking to be answered, but it’s still not a type C Yes or No type question, like “Do you need his love?”

For example – “What would it mean to you if he were not to love you?” <– that question is looking in a specific direction for a question. Type B has more specific parameters designed to tailor a limited direction they can look in. This is what i mean by corralling the horses.

As things deepen, they intensify and to avoid the circling around the drain situation, we have to begin tailoring the questions based on our observations of what is happening with them. So we don’t have to tell them, no. not directly. But yes, we ask the questions specifically in a fashion (Type B questions) that limits the direction they can go, except in the direction we want to really ask about.

Even though Type B questions are more “corralling” in nature, they still are non directional energetically, or with expectation.

Here’s another example of a Type B question –

Patient says, “Then it’s just me on my own. There’s only so much I can do.”

Type B question: “What is the problem with you just being on your own?” We’re introducing the focus that it’s a problem and it’s a problem being on your own as well. So it’s a highly textured question where we’re opening up the fence to corral the horses into that particular direction.

Another type B question – “What is keeping you there with that person?”

This question is asking for a specific focus on “what is keeping you there?” not just “how do you feel about that?” which is a Type A question. So there is the “what” in the question – specifically, what is it? and then the aspect of keeping you there… is another focus point of the question.

the deeper we go, the more info we have. The more info we have, the more we have to tailor Type B questions to be using those points of information as focal points for our questions. This tightens up and deepens the dialogue. 😎🤓😍